Senator Stark Raving Mad, you have the floor.

[Obfuscate]

YouTube - Rep. Pete Stark's Unbelievable Comments

If this doesn't warrant discussion I don't know what does.

[Aemaeth]

A fitting quote.

Man is the only Patriot. He sets himself apart in his own country, under his own flag, and sneers at the other nations, and keeps multitudinous uniformed assassins on hand at heavy expense to grab slices of other people's countries, and keep them from grabbing slices of his. And in the intervals between campaigns he washes the blood off his hands and works for "the universal brotherhood of man" - with his mouth.
- Mark Twain

And another.

N[SIZE=2]othing, amounts to Nothing, realizing Nothing, afraid of Nothing, act upon Nothing, stopping at Nothing, consider Nothing, consequence
Nothing,
Comes Back, Like Wolves.[/SIZE]

[BrioCloud]

He had a point. And then he messed up because he was so mad. Lol!

No idea how the quotes relate. Explain please.

[bigdeath]

This dude is absolutely right. Think how much the govenment treats us like idiots. I know I've said this time and time again, but think about it. How are they going to tell us that they don't have the money to fund programs such as Social Security and Medicare or that there is no money to support a universal healthcare plan like damn near the rest of earth has, when they constantly throw money at nations that hate us. We have needy people here, we have people living in sub-derelict conditions here, yet we continue to blow money on a pointless war. And for all you out there that says a universal healthcare plan won't work let Aemaeth tell you about it. Does it work for England?

[BrioCloud]

This dude is absolutely right. Think how much the govenment treats us like idiots. I know I've said this time and time again, but think about it. How are they going to tell us that they don't have the money to fund programs such as Social Security and Medicare or that there is no money to support a universal healthcare plan like damn near the rest of earth has, when they constantly throw money at nations that hate us. We have needy people here, we have people living in sub-derelict conditions here, yet we continue to blow money on a pointless war. And for all you out there that says a universal healthcare plan won't work let Aemaeth tell you about it. Does it work for England?

It is just like what Bush says. Its the fight against "terrorism". There definitely won't be Social Security if we are terrorized by terrorist, by the acts of terrorism.

[Blue]

It is just like what Bush says. Its the fight against "terrorism". There definitely won't be Social Security if we are terrorized by terrorist, by the acts of terrorism.

I agree, we could easily get bombed again, and all Bigdeath is worrying about is his own hide and weather there's a dollar in it.

[BrioCloud]

I agree, we could easily get bombed again, and all Bigdeath is worrying about is his own hide and weather there's a dollar in it.

ROFLOLMAO! laugh:

Edit: But on a more serious note, which is what I was trying to get across in our funny talk with BlueBleeder is that he obviously feels that our security and our lively-hood and our whole nation's survival is more important than Social Security.

[bigdeath]

See this is where you guys buy into Bush's load of shit. Anyone that thinks that we are in Iraq just because of terrorism is a moron. There are government officials that admit the war was largely because of oil. Look at Alan Greenspan for example. And think about it. How can you limit the war on terror to just one country. That sounds fishy in itself. There is terror all over the place. We got attacked on 911 for a reason. Why would they just conduct a random act of violence? I don't care just about myself blue. I just hate it when our government takes our tax dollars and spends them on something the majority of the country does not favor. Look at this link.
National Priorities Project - The Cost of War

Then think about how much our government says that there is just not enough money to fund programs that benefit our society. It's ludicrous! We are all just being played for fools.

[itsjustme]

I have to agree with Bigdeath on this one. The war started out with good intentions on the surface but quickly became a war that had nothing to do with terrorists. If you remember back to the start, one of the reasons that Bush gave for the war was that Iraq had secret weapons of mass destruction. In 2005 that theory was shot through and they had to move on.

Source: CIA’s final report: No WMD found in Iraq - Conflict in Iraq - MSNBC.com

We've had Korea testing missiles and proof that they have some pointed at us...do we do anything? No. We continue to fight in a country that we have zero right to be in.

Do I believe that our Country needs to protect itself against terrorists? You better believe it. But I also believe that our Country is going about it all the wrong way. We've looked in Iraq, we didn't find what we were looking for. It's time to move on. Step up our security...look elsewhere and be smart about it all. Stop wasting billions and billions of dollars and use it for good. Shit, this country is going to be in debt until the end of the Earth!

[BrioCloud]

See this is where you guys buy into Bush's load of shit. Anyone that thinks that we are in Iraq just because of terrorism is a moron.

Lol. Yes I do. Oil is only an extra. Theres a word for people who doesn't believe the government is Conspiracist. Thats not far from believing that the government wants to plant chips in our brains and track our every move. I for one have seen all the Conspiracy videos about our government.

Why is he staying in Iraq so long? Well its his job, if you believes we should stay there longer to protect our ass, the so be it and stay there. If you feel that you know more about presidency than he is by all means go get elected and see if anybody votes for you.

Again.

It is just like what Bush says. Its the fight against "terrorism". There definitely won't be Social Security if we are terrorized by terrorist, by the acts of terrorism.

I agree, we could easily get bombed again, and all Bigdeath is worrying about is his own hide and weather there's a dollar in it.

Lol.

[Aemaeth]

He had a point. And then he messed up because he was so mad. Lol!

No idea how the quotes relate. Explain please.

It's plainly obvious and if you don't understand them now you never will. blank:

Theres a word for people who doesn't believe the government is Conspiracist

That's a rather vague term. Do you beleive EVERYTHING you are told?

[BrioCloud]

It's plainly obvious and if you don't understand them now you never will. blank:

Ohkay.

Vague term? Everything I'm told? I have no reasons to believe that their NOT doing the right thing. Where is the evidence. People are basing it on what an evil person would do. Maybe how you would do it. Dr.Phil can be some sort of Nazi guy, thats why hes so popular? No. I don't think so.

If you believe some Video made by some college kid with eerie talk about the government rather than the government than suit yourself. I don't believe everything I'm told thats why I don't believe you.

Heres some videos you might like about the war and 9/11.

9/11 Stuff - Government Conspiracy Videos

Knock yourselves out conspiracy theorists.

[Aemaeth]

You missed my point.

I have no reasons to believe that their NOT doing the right thing.

They where doing the right thing in the first place, But what are they doing now?

While the war is just, The soldiers aren't.

On May 30th, US troops shot and killed two Iraqi women -- one of whom was pregnant. Nabiha Nisaif Jassim and her cousin Saliha Mohammed Hassan were in a car going to Samarra General hospital where Nabiha was about to give birth.

NEAR KARBALA, March 31 - As an unidentified four-wheel drive vehicle came barreling toward an intersection held by troops of the Army's 3rd Infantry Division, Capt. Ronny Johnson grew increasingly alarmed. From his position at the intersection, he was heard radioing to one of his forward platoons of M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles to alert it to what he described as a potential threat.
"Fire a warning shot," he ordered as the vehicle kept coming. Then, with increasing urgency, he told the platoon to shoot a 7.62mm machine-gun round into its radiator. "Stop [messing] around!" Johnson yelled into the company radio network when he still saw no action being taken. Finally, he shouted at the top of his voice, "Stop him, Red 1, stop him!"
[SIZE=2][SIZE=2] [SIZE=1]
US troops kill ten women, kids at checkpoint: US military
[/SIZE][/SIZE]That order was immediately followed by the loud reports of 25mm cannon fire from one or more of the platoon's Bradleys. About half a dozen shots were heard in all.[/SIZE]
"Cease fire!" Johnson yelled over the radio. Then, as he peered into his binoculars from the intersection on Highway 9, he roared at the platoon leader, "You just [expletive] killed a family because you didn't fire a warning shot soon enough!"

Your army is incompetent and bloodthirsty.
This casts it in another light, no?

[Metalhead Steve]

YouTube - Bush-Truly not concerned about bin Laden

I love how the war in Iraq is called the war on terrorism... In 2001 when our troops were deployed we were looking for Osama Bin Laden, now what are we doing? Suppressing a country and forcing a government of our own upon it in my opinion. Terrorism as our reason for war has been out the window for a few years now and the only reason we are still there is because big companies are making big money off of it.

We had absolutely no reason to go into Iraq. We have had two reasons thrown in our face. "Saddam was a brutal dictator," and he had "Weapons of mass destruction." From what I can see only the former is true and that wouldn't be our problem. If he really needed to be removed from power the US government should have done so in the first Gulf War.

In 2007 there should be only one force left in the middle east from the US. I agree we should have peacekeepers in Afghanistan to make sure the Taliban do not try to overthrow the country but even that force should be small because the Afghan army should be large enough to combat such an attempt. I guess the best thing I can compare this idea to is the "military advisors" the US sent in at the beginning of the Vietnam war. They likely wouldn't see combat and if they did it would be minimal because the Afghan army would be running the show.

I think this is a very agreeable idea because of how long our troops have been stationed over their it should no longer be a full scale guerrilla war.

[itsjustme]

YouTube - Bush-Truly not concerned about bin Laden

I love how the war in Iraq is called the war on terrorism... In 2001 when our troops were deployed we were looking for Osama Bin Laden, now what are we doing? Suppressing a country and forcing a government of our own upon it in my opinion. Terrorism as our reason for war has been out the window for a few years now and the only reason we are still there is because big companies are making big money off of it.

We had absolutely no reason to go into Iraq. We have had two reasons thrown in our face. "Saddam was a brutal dictator," and he had "Weapons of mass destruction." From what I can see only the former is true and that wouldn't be our problem. If he really needed to be removed from power the US government should have done so in the first Gulf War.

In 2007 there should be only one force left in the middle east from the US. I agree we should have peacekeepers in Afghanistan to make sure the Taliban do not try to overthrow the country but even that force should be small because the Afghan army should be large enough to combat such an attempt. I guess the best thing I can compare this idea to is the "military advisors" the US sent in at the beginning of the Vietnam war. They likely wouldn't see combat and if they did it would be minimal because the Afghan army would be running the show.

I think this is a very agreeable idea because of how long our troops have been stationed over their it should no longer be a full scale guerrilla war.

Dead on!

[bigdeath]

YouTube - Bush-Truly not concerned about bin Laden

I love how the war in Iraq is called the war on terrorism... In 2001 when our troops were deployed we were looking for Osama Bin Laden, now what are we doing? Suppressing a country and forcing a government of our own upon it in my opinion. Terrorism as our reason for war has been out the window for a few years now and the only reason we are still there is because big companies are making big money off of it.

We had absolutely no reason to go into Iraq. We have had two reasons thrown in our face. "Saddam was a brutal dictator," and he had "Weapons of mass destruction." From what I can see only the former is true and that wouldn't be our problem. If he really needed to be removed from power the US government should have done so in the first Gulf War.

In 2007 there should be only one force left in the middle east from the US. I agree we should have peacekeepers in Afghanistan to make sure the Taliban do not try to overthrow the country but even that force should be small because the Afghan army should be large enough to combat such an attempt. I guess the best thing I can compare this idea to is the "military advisors" the US sent in at the beginning of the Vietnam war. They likely wouldn't see combat and if they did it would be minimal because the Afghan army would be running the show.

I think this is a very agreeable idea because of how long our troops have been stationed over their it should no longer be a full scale guerrilla war.

I agree wholeheartedly. We are achieving nothing in Iraq. And ponder this if you will. Imagine they bring the war to our soil in order to save us from president bush. They try to bomb a terrorist, but instead hit your house and kill your family. Say I was the recruiter for a militant organization that opposed their occupation of our country. Because what has happened it would be very easy for me to get you to fight for my cause with great conviction. Not to mention the religious aspect of it. Another thing. If Bush is so honest why does he call himself a christian? He is a freakin Freemason. Those two don't mesh to well together. You have to look at this situation from a non-partisan perspective.

[BrioCloud]

Well I'm sorry that trying to surpress terrorism involve casualties. Bush did not send the Troops and ordered them to bomb and kill families. You guys forgot that 9/11 was what started it all. If you guys don't think we should fight for this or want to think the people who did this shouldn't be punished or captured, or even think this was made by the government, then thats all you. I for one can not stand by and do nothing against what had happened since then. Maybe we should of recalled the troops a bit earlier, but other than that, their doing the right thing.

I just saw half of the movie World Trade Center. Think about the thousands and thousands of people in that two building, think about the fire fighters that bravely went up there, the families that were traumatized. I almost teared every time I saw those police officers and thousands of people died by being pulverized by the collapsing building. I don't think I can convince you guys to think otherwise. Sorry if I anger anybody. It is not my intentions to.

I can't stand the heat. And I'm getting out the kitchen.

[Halcyon]

How in hell can you ever support Bush? It's a sin in itself to even contemplate it. This war is no longer against terrorism, it hasn't been for some time now.

[Metalhead Steve]

Well I'm sorry that trying to surpress terrorism involve casualties. Bush did not send the Troops and ordered them to bomb and kill families. You guys forgot that 9/11 was what started it all. If you guys don't think we should fight for this or want to think the people who did this shouldn't be punished or captured, or even think this was made by the government, then thats all you. I for one can not stand by and do nothing against what had happened since then. Maybe we should of recalled the troops a bit earlier, but other than that, their doing the right thing.

I just saw half of the movie World Trade Center. Think about the thousands and thousands of people in that two building, think about the fire fighters that bravely went up there, the families that were traumatized. I almost teared every time I saw those police officers and thousands of people died by being pulverized by the collapsing building. I don't think I can convince you guys to think otherwise. Sorry if I anger anybody. It is not my intentions to.

I can't stand the heat. And I'm getting out the kitchen.

I see where your coming from but Iraq was never about the war on terror... That was the point I made. We should have stayed in Afghanistan instead of going into Iraq as well. Iraq is an unneeded mess created by the Bush administration. I would fully support the war in Afghanistan if that was all they did, but at this point Afghanistan seems trivial to them.

[bigdeath]

Also in our attempt to fight terrorist. We're giving them a cause to fight for. Half the people we are fighting now probably had no intention on fighting before we went over there. I admit if we leave now theyy will probably collapse into anarchy , but we should have never went there in the first place.