*KICKER SIN* Build to end all Builds

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

FENIX' KICKSIN aka JAGERMEISTER (PVP and PVM)

Preface- This is a work in progress, a Build/Guide for a good kicker assassin. I am aiming at building a well rounded Kicker. I have read threads upon threads about kickers on this forum and countless others to get all ideas possible (and yes, before you say it, im aware that they arent really good in PvP). I am asking on opinions and possibly more ideas on how to make this sin as good as she can possibly be. I want a PvP gear setup and a PvM gear setup. NOTE: When I say PvM, as im not worried about regular PvM as it is easy to master, I mean Ubers.


Skills:

20 Dragon Talon (primary attack)
20 Fade (Resists+Dr)
20 Venom
20 Blade Shield

1 Dragon Flight
1 Burst of Speed (more?)
1 Mind Blast
1 Death Sentry
1 Cloak of Shadows
1 Shadow Master

(What should the rest of the points be piled into? I am looking for opinions on this.)

Stats:

Strength- enough for gear
Dexterity- enough for max block
Vitality- The rest
Energy- None

Gear:

Helm-

Shako
PvM- Guilaumes (Also, a good helm for PvP)
Vamp Gaze (Keep in mind, Leach does not work in PvP)
Crown of Ages
Kira's (Cannot Be Frozen mod)

Amulet-

Mara's
Metalgrid
Angelics


Rings-

*BK*
*Ravenfrost* (Cannot Be Frozen mod)
Angelics
Carrion Wind

Belt-

Verdungo's
Nosferatu's Coil
Trangs (Cannot Be Frozen mod)

Gloves-

PvM- Laying of Hands (insane boost to damage due to 350% Dmg to Demons Modifier)
PvP- Trangs (25% Poison Damage mod. Necessary for good poison in PvP)
Drac's (BM PVP or PvM Alternative if not using LastWish)


Boots-

Up'd Gores (Highest damage boots with the crushing blow mod)
Shadow Dancer's (A VERY good alternative with skill boosts)

Armor-

PvP- Bramble (Used primarily for the insane boost to your poisons)
PvM- Chains of Honor (This armor is the best for Ubers due to the 200% Dmg to Demons. Combined with Laying of Hands gloves, You will do FIVE and a HALF times damage to the ubers.)
Fort
Enigma

Weapon- Primary:

PvM or BM PvP- Lastwish/Stormshield
PVP- Grief/Stormshield
PvP- Beast/Stormshield

Seconday:

Call To Arms/Spirit

PVP FUN:

Widowmaker Bow (Can be used to cast guided arrow that will pack a punch with your massive Poison Damage)

Inventory-

Torch
Annhilus
Poison Damage Charms
FHR Charms to reach max Breapoint
Resist All Charms to hit max Resists
Martial Art Skill Grand Charms

NOTE: I have provided gear to get the Cannot Be Frozen mod if one chose not to use RavenFrost, as I see it is necessary to have this mod in either PvM or PvP.


KICK PROCS: These are what will work with kick.

- Leech (both from equipment and CS)
- Elemental Damage/Venom
- Crushing Blow
- Open Wounds
- Prevent Monster Heal
- Chance to Cast on Striking
- Hit Causes Monster to Flee
- Ignore Target Defense
- Hit Blinds Target
- Hit Slows Target
- Hit Freezes Target
- Chance to Cast on Attacking
- KnockBack

Breakpoints:

Faster Hit Recovery Breakpoint table (Frame:FHR):
9: 0%
8: 7%
7: 15%
6: 27%
5: 48%
4: 86%
3: 200%

More Assassin Breakpoint Tables: (not my tables, props go to people here: ALL IAS/FHR/FCR tables!!! - Zelaron)

Starting Stats Stat Point Returns
Strength Dexterity Vitality Energy
20 20 20 25

Life per Vitality /Mana per Energy
3 / 1.5

Faster Hit Recovery Breakpoints
Frame 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2
FHR Needed 0% 7% 15% 27% 48% 86% 200% 4680%

Faster Cast Rate Breakpoints
Frame 16 15 14 13 12 11 10 9
FCR Needed 0% 8% 16% 24% 42% 65% 102% 174%

Faster Block Rate Breakpoints
Frame 5 4 3 2 1
FBR Needed 0% 13% 32% 86% 600%

Kick Damage Formula Claw Damage Formula
MinDmg = (str+dex-20)/4)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMinDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100

MaxDmg = (str+dex-20)/3)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMaxDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100
MinDmg = ([str x 0.75] + [dex + 0.75] + 1 + [Skill bonuses Tiger + DragonClaw + Claw mastery]) X Weapon Min Damage

MaxDmg = ([str x 0.75] + [dex + 0.75] + 1 + [Skill bonuses Tiger + DragonClaw + Claw mastery]) X Weapon Max Damage

Claw IAS
Frame 15.5 15.0 14.5 14.0 13.5 13.0 12.5 12.0 11.5 11.0 10.5 10.0 9.5 9.0 8.5 8.0 7.5
Runic Talons / Greater Talons (-30) 0% 10% 25% 30% 50% 60%
Feral Claws (-20)
0% 5% 20% 40% 45% 75% 90%
Battle Cestus / Wrist Sword (-10) 0% 5% 20% 35% 60% 65% 105% 120%
Suwayyah / Scissors Suwayyah (0) 0% 10% 15% 20% 30% 50% 55% 85% 90% 145% 170%
War Fist (10)
0% 5% 10% 20% 30% 50% 75% 120% 125% 200% 240%

Claw (Tiger/Cobra Strike) IAS Breakpoints
Frame 15 14 13 12 11 10 9 8 7
Runic Talons / Greater Talons (-30) 0% 10% 30% 60%
Feral Claws (-20) 0% 5% 20% 45% 90%
Battle Cestus / Wrist Sword (-10) 0% 5% 20% 35% 65% 120%
Suwayyah / Scissors Suwayyah (0) 0% 10% 15% 30% 55% 90% 170%
War Fist (10) 0% 5% 10% 20% 30% 50% 75% 125% 240%

Elemental IAS Breakpoints
Frame 21 20 19 18 17 16 15 14 13 12 11 10 9 8 7
Runic Talons / Greater Talons (-30) 0% 15% 30% 50% 90% 180%
Feral Claws (-20) 0% 5% 15% 25% 45% 70% 120% 260%
Battle Cestus / Wrist Sword (-10) 0% 5% 10% 15% 25% 40% 65% 100% 170%
Suwayyah / Scissors Suwayyah (0) 0% 5% 10% 15% 20% 30% 40% 60% 90% 140% 240%
War Fist (10) 0% 5% 10% 15% 20% 30% 35% 50% 60% 90% 125% 195%

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*PvM Setup (Ubers): This is my thoughts on gear for killing Ubers.

Helm- Guilaumes (Um'd for resists)
Armor- Chains of Honor (primarily for 200% Damage to Demons)
Gloves- Laying of Hands (IAS+ 350% Damage to Demons)
Rings- BK/Raven (for much needed Cannot Be Frozen)
Ammy- Metalgrid
Weapon- Last Wish (Massive CB and Lifetap)
Sheild- Stormsheild (Um'd for resists)
Belt- Verdungo's
Boots- Up'd Gores

Inventory: Charms needed to reach 200% FHR Breakpoint. Charms to max Resists. Possibly MaxDamage/AR Charms.

I'm sure alot of you are thinking CoA would be better then Guilaumes. HOWEVER, it would not be worth waisting all those points into Strength to use CoA when, you will easily hit max DR with maxed Fade skill and Stormshield.

*PVP Setup: (disreguarding Lifetap as BM)

Helm- Guilaumes (Um'd for resists)
Armor- Bramble (50% to Poison Skill Damage)
Gloves- Trangs (25% Poison Skill Damage)
Rings- BK/Raven (Cannot Be Frozen)
Ammy- Metalgrid (Resis+AR)
Weapon- Last Wish
Sheild- Stormsheild (Um'd for resists)
Belt- Mara's (Skills+Slow target) or Verdungo's
Boots- Up'd Gores


I would like some opinions on the PVP Build as well. Particularly the Weapon since I consider Lifetap as Bad Manners in duel.


Other Questions I have for you. What are IAS Breakpoints for Kick? Does it depend on claw/weapon speed? and either way could somebody provide a simple table if I was using a phaseblade LastWish?

REVIEW: Thanks for going over this, I have spent alot of time and thought coming up with this, and I hope I can get some input and answers to my questions. As i said in the preface, this is a guide/build IN THE MAKING, so any input to my questions would help me tie this together. I will be writing up strategies for both the UBERS, and VS all the different types of characters in PvP as soon as I can. On a final note....my final kicker sin is waiting on my questions to be answered before i put her together so OPINIONS/COMMENTS/ANSWERS ARE VERY WELCOME and much needed. THANK YOU.

[FraterPerdurabo]

So you actually decided to make one, awesome. Good job.

[Nex]

I'm liking the sound of this build with the Widow Maker, you have inspired me to make a character i thought i would never make.
Very nice guide, deserves + Rep.

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

Thanks guys
any1 that has experience with kickers, or simply a differing opinion on what gear to wear and why, please let me know! Thanks

[Espada]

guide is good but don't forget you can always keep a beast in your stash for the extra speed to your kicks

[FraterPerdurabo]

guide is good but don't forget you can always keep a beast in your stash for the extra speed to your kicks

Really? I thought that Kick speed was determined by skill level, not IAS%?

Anyway, moved + stickied.

[Lux Aeterna]

I'd just like to comment, you've been doing a very thorough job with this build. Best wishes on making it truly the "build to end all builds"

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

guide is good but don't forget you can always keep a beast in your stash for the extra speed to your kicks

that is actually a really good idea for a GM pvp weapon, i totally forgot about beast! it has crushing blow, and open wounds, and best of all the 40%IAS that is then boosted by lvl 9 fanat. im very interested to see how much dmg the fanat would increase the kick as well, as its tough to boost kick damage with anything other then elemental damage.

Now that got me thinking..... I wonder how a Fortitude Weapon, lets say a phaseblade, would work. It is at first glance, appealing. Yet I will elaborate on why it is sub-efficient compared to other weapons.

NOTE: This isnt to anyone of you guys in particular, but more as a... addon to the guide that i will put in when i start to finish it up.

[SIZE=-1] 20% Chance To Cast Level 15 Chilling Armor when Struck
+25% Faster Cast Rate
+300% Enhanced Damage
+9 To Minimum Damage
+50 To Attack Rating
20% Deadly Strike
Hit Causes Monster To Flee 25%
+200% Enhanced Defense
+X To Life (Based on Character Level)*
All Resistances +25-30 (varies)
12% Damage Taken Goes To Mana
+1 To Light Radius[/SIZE]

quote courtesy of the one and only Arreat Summit.

The extra resistances never hurt, the dmg to mana also never hurts. Not to mention the life bonus, little attack rating and deadly strike. However, the one mod that would make it useable over a LastWish, or even Beast, would be the 300% Enh. Damage modifier. The only problem is that very similar to smite, the ED will have no effect on Kick damage. This is due to the fact that it directly affects the weapon's damage. Since our actual weapon is the boots, and the base damage is dependent on the boot type, it has nothing to do with the weapon type that you have equipped.

So...that being said...and me basically telling myself why fort would not make a good weapon :LoL: i come to a question.

What about a Famine Axe?

FAMINE
[SIZE=-1] +30% Increased Attack Speed
+320-370% Enhanced Damage (varies)
Ignore Target's Defense
Adds 180-200 Magic Damage
Adds 50-200 Fire Damage
Adds 51-250 Lightning Damage
Adds 50-200 Cold Damage
12% Life Stolen Per Hit
Prevent Monster Heal
+10 To Strength[/SIZE]

Quote again, courtesy of Arreat Summit

I am trying to decide whether the big elemental and magic damage would be output through my kick. I know, from the information i have gathered, that elemental damage is ouput through kicks. HOWEVER, would that only apply to say charms adding elemental damage, such as Poison ?(Which happens to be one of the biggest parts of a PVP Kicker). What do you guys think? Even though if famine did give its dmg bonuses to kick, it would basically make no difference in pvp, yet i am curious anyways. And it would also be helpful to have in my guide in the end

I am going to test this in Single player, using hero editor, to make it easier to find out. But still give me your take on it i want to hear from more of you! its very helpful and encouraging to get input.

I'd just like to comment, you've been doing a very thorough job with this build. Best wishes on making it truly the "build to end all builds"

Thank you very much. I really appreciate it. For a few days I was wondering whether i had sparked any interest whatsoever, or if any1 had even read through the guide or not. So i do appreciate it. Thanks again to you all.

Really? I thought that Kick speed was determined by skill level, not IAS%?

Anyway, moved + stickied.

Through my experiences so far, skill level only effects the kick's damage and how many kicks you actually do per "Cast" if you will. The skill is very similar to Zeal. A good way to look at it, is it is a type of cross between Zeal and Smite. That being because number of kicks and damage is affected by skill level. However, similar to a Paladin's Smite, your base damage does not come from your actual weapon, but your boots.

MAKE SURE TO NOTE that this example of Dragon Talon Kick being a type of cross between Zeal and Smite is not a definitive way to look at it. It works for the situation I described above, but there are alot of big differences. For example, smite does not need attack rating as it always hits, but this is not how it works for Kicks. (Though...that would be INSANE XD) I did not intend to confuse anybody.

This of coarse you already know frater. I am just elaborating to whoever else may be reading and does not know much about it. Only Assassin skill effecting speed of kicks, to my knowledge, is Burst of Speed.

[DJ_MUTTA]

Venom does not effect kick skills as far as i know?

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

venom does, it adds alot of poison dmg, it just isnt onscreen damage. in other words, you can not see your poison dmg on your kicks in your character screen/attribute screen.

this only goes for kicks. if u changed to normal attack with your weapon, you can see the added dmg on screen from venom.

OH btw, i just found out that you can not have both precast skills Burst of Speed(BoS) and Fade casted at a time. Due to this, it is not worth putting points into BoS with the skill points u have left after maxing the needed. You would be better off putting them into one of the minions. (shadow warrior or shadow master)

MORE INFORMATION ON FADE:
i have found out that the reduction of curse duration by fade, ALSO reduces duration of shrines (XP Shrine, Skill Shrine ECT). To avoid waisting your shrines, cast Burst of Speed before clicking on the shrine. Do not recast fade until after the shrine bonus expires.

NEW INFORMATION ON VENOM:

Venom caps the poisoning duration at 0.4 seconds, thus preventing long term poisoning. Consequently, all other items will only inflict poison damage for 0.4 seconds. Example: Though 700 damage over 10 seconds might seem impressive only 28 damage will be inflicted due to the 0.4 seconds cap.

from arreat summit.

So this would mean that a single 100 Poison Damage Small Charm would do much less dmg. To calculate the actual poison damage you will gain, do this:

100pdsc's are 100poison damage over 5 seconds.
to find out how much damager per second, you would do this.
100/5= 20 poison damage per second (20 pd/s)
Now since our poison only goes for 0.4 seconds, you must multiply the pd/s by 0.4.
20*0.4=8 poison dmg.

you might find this to be somewhat discouraging information, as 8 poison damage is not much. This is still pretty good bonus to your poison damage. You will apply poison for each kick that lands. So hypothetically speaking, if you attacked a person 5 times with dragon talon, you can potentially hit 20 times. even if u miss 1 kick for every set of 4, you still hit 16 times. now you base boot damage will be 83-149. your actual kick dmg will be much higher because every point in STR you have, adds dmg. and every point u have in dragon talon adds damage as well. say we are lookin at a average of 1000dmg a kick(which is a rather low estimate). now you would be doing an average of 435 poison per kick. multiply these by 16. it would put you at 16000 melee dmg and 6960 poison damage pure RAW output
without considering your Crushing blow which multiplies damage by 2 when it procs. adding just one 100pdsc, your poison damage in this situation goes up to 7088. so at first glance, 8 extra poison doesnt seem like much, but it helps alot.
Here is a small table to tell you how much damage you will gain on top of your venom for each type of poison damage SMALL Charm.

Poison Damage Small Charms (SC Mod/actual gain with Venom):

100 over 5 seconds/ 8.00 Poison
175 over 6 seconds/ 11.60 Poison
251 over 10 seconds/ 10.04 Poison
313 over 11 seconds/ 11.38 Poison
377 over 11 seconds/ 13.71 Poison
451 over 12 seconds/ 15.03 Poison


these are all REAL, and LEGIT small charms you can get a hold of on ladder as well as nonladder.

This table was calculated and put together by me.

[Jammer74]

Venom actually does work on kicks,and u can actually see the damage if u use dragontail kick.Its just that the lcs(lying character screen) doesn't show the additional damage from elemental or poison when u use dragon talon or dragonflight.Another alternative to sword/shield is claw/claw with enuff points in weaponblock to hit 61%,which is actually better imo than shield block,as u have a chance to block elemental damage from spells and magic damage from bonespirit as well.Use a fury claw with venom skill mods for mass openwounds,and use a good rare fools claw w/ other good mods like ias and skills.Use a verdungo,and put a ber in the guillames face.Upped gores,like u said or +2 shadowdancers are the only real choices for boots.imo the shadow dancers are the best choice,as u will have enuff cb and openwound from guillames and fury.

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

i have also looked at dual claw build, however i found it to be less effective for PvM. The only reason i havent put dual claw information up YET is that i have yet to see if i can max Weapon Block skill with all the other skills that i will use for PvM. Also the main reason i chose a shield build for PvM (ubers) is because you must get max DR. with only SS and Fade, i will have max DR. Also, with Last Wish you gain insane CB, and lifetap which will be the only reason you can survive.

i debated with myself for a while whether or not to put in the dual claw information up yet. I opted not to for now, even though i have already written it.

if i end up with extra points on my final buld, and no where else to put them, chances are id go for weapon block. making me very versatile, in the ability to go from weapon/shield to claw/claw with no negative consequences.

[FraterPerdurabo]

Also, remember that when you are walking, you have a chance to block%, whereas when you are moving, Claw Block does not work, so 0% chance.

[Jammer74]

Very good point on the weapon block,Frater.One benefit from weapon block as opposed to shield block ,though,is the fact that you dont have to put points in dex to achieve the block %,which means more points in vitality.Also if u put 20 points into fade,plus 2 points from shadow dancers,plus torch and anni,,you will achieve 26% damage reduction(thanks to arreat summit for the info).Add 15% from dungo,not to mention the vit bbost,and if your using coh,thats 8% from the ber,plus a ber'ed guillames face,you easily achieve the 50% dr that you so desperately need.Now the lastwish is a darn good idea,but I was just trying to say that there are other ways to achieve crushing blow,and even lifetap(dracs gloves being the only option for a claw claw assn).Plus if u are doing ubers,u wont be running much,lol,you will be kicking the crap out of them,and weaponblock does work while attacking,so really it does sound like a viable alternative,to me anyway.At least if I made you consider the pros of c/c,then my job is done here,lol.

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

Very good point on the weapon block,Frater.One benefit from weapon block as opposed to shield block ,though,is the fact that you dont have to put points in dex to achieve the block %,which means more points in vitality.Also if u put 20 points into fade,plus 2 points from shadow dancers,plus torch and anni,,you will achieve 26% damage reduction(thanks to arreat summit for the info).Add 15% from dungo,not to mention the vit bbost,and if your using coh,thats 8% from the ber,plus a ber'ed guillames face,you easily achieve the 50% dr that you so desperately need.Now the lastwish is a darn good idea,but I was just trying to say that there are other ways to achieve crushing blow,and even lifetap(dracs gloves being the only option for a claw claw assn).Plus if u are doing ubers,u wont be running much,lol,you will be kicking the crap out of them,and weaponblock does work while attacking,so really it does sound like a viable alternative,to me anyway.At least if I made you consider the pros of c/c,then my job is done here,lol.

i wrote a c/c setup when i wrote this guide up but i decided not to include it yet. it is a very viable alternative, dont get me wrong! i just much prefer a w/s build for a few reasons

[Jammer74]

Thats cool Fenix,and don't get me wrong either,as there is nothing wrong w/ your build,It actually rocks much.I just happen to prefer claw/claw myself,and my c/c assns have been able to own w/s kickers in duel games.Although I don't think any of them put the effort into the build that you have.Good luck and good build Fenix.Thank you for the intelligent conversation.

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

anytime xD . im actually glad to see someone lookin over the build to comment it in the first place. i need some good C&C or the guide will never get better, or be anything for that matter.

[Jammer74]

Btw fenix,I built this build on hero editor and tried it againts the ubers(single player,using plugY).C/C or w/s,this build eats the ubers up,not quite as fast as a good smiter,but faster than some barb builds I've tried.Both w/s and c/c take the ubers down to next to no life,but the w/s build kills quicker(higher damage from the lw might aura?)The only thing different i tried was instead of stormshield,I tried an upped moser's circle(luna),with 2 40/15's(I guess you could use 2 15ias/15 resist jewels as well)The speed difference from the dragon talon is amazing.I just thought I'd throw that out there as food for thought.Also,because you don't get much damage from more skill points in blade shield,instead of maxing it you could put 5 points or so in it,and rely on skill boosts for more duration,hence,opening up more skill points for other skills(for example,a couple of points in death sentry for the corpse explosion effect)or even put more points into a shadowmaster.

[FeNiXSuNfIrE]

awesome jammer, im glad that someone has taken the time to look at this a little more in depth. i have yet to be able to rebuild my sin because both of my computers have decided to have hardware blowouts *sigh. but i was planning to build it up in heroeditor as well to see what kind of limits i could push her to.

on the C/C did you try whirlwind out at all?

and as for the blade shield, i realize that too now lookin at the stat for stat gain per level on the skill, and i would agree. death sentry kicks ass in PvE, and one of the shadowmasters with some more points in it could never hurt.

tomorrow im headed to my parents house for christmas break so ill be able to get on a computer. would you mind sending me your file of the character over email? that would save me a little time

keep workin on her see what else u can find out, ill be back tomorrow to probably input some more stuff in the guide and comment on her performance.

thanks jamm

[Bluesky81]

This is an impressive build obviously based on some very comprehensive research, and though I am no authority on d2, having attempted Tristam with every variation of character in the game, only two, my barb and pally, could do it, and they both effortlessly conquer Tristam within minutes in solo play. The rest failed miserably in as much time. If this kicker succeeds please let us know, I would like to build one like it.
Good luck,

392 JIW The Pofessor