MUHAHAHAHA Presidential Election 2008!!

[Aemaeth]

If you guys **** up even more i'm gonna be pissed.
Because we're getting dragged down with you.

[SpoonMan999]

Obama was a teacher and a community organizer...he's only been a Senator for a year. Being a governor and mayor and doing a good job at both is a much better resume.

[El Matt]

Obama was a teacher and a community organizer...he's only been a Senator for a year. Being a governor and mayor and doing a good job at both is a much better resume.

barack obama:
graduated from harvard law school magna cum laude
practiced law as a civil rights attorney
you refer to teacher pretty broadly - he taught constitutional law from 2002 to 2004 at the university of chicago law school
he served in the illinois state senate from 1997 to 2004
he actually has been a u.s. senator since 2005

sarah palin:
transfered between 4 different universities on her way to a b.s in journalism
served on the wasilla(her home town) city council, elected in 1992 and 1995 separately
served as the wasilla mayor from 1996-2002
elected to the governorship of alaska in 2006 to present times

hmm, i'm putting my faith into obama on this one

[Nethran]

EXPERIENCE MEANS LITTLE!

I had to cap it to make sure people saw it. Look at our last Persident. He's a **** up, but he had lots of years as Gov. of Texas and 4 years of actually BEING persident before it got THIS bad.

It takes critical thinking and common sense to be President. Combine the two and you can figure things out well enough to do what needs to be done. The problem was that George Bush is a cowboy. To blinded by himself and what he thinks is right to think and see straight, to see what is ACTUALLY right.

What we need to be voting on is who has the best combination of the two; which of the candidates has the ability to adapt his views to what needs to be done? Yes, their plans for their presidency are important, also, but things change and they need to change with them.

Don't base your opinions on experience. If experience was everything, Math would know how to spell by now.

[Frai7ty]

If you guys **** up even more i'm gonna be pissed.
Because we're getting dragged down with you.

Off Topic: Where you at on the EU man?

On Topic: Voting for Obama. Because we need someone who breaks the status quo, and Republicans tend to keep the status quo. Sure thats great sometimes, but right now thats deffently not a good thing.

Also, I'm not going to vote for a guy who thinks Spain is a Latin American country... WTF *Face Palm*

[Aemaeth]

Off Topic: Where you at on the EU man?

On Topic: Voting for Obama. Because we need someone who breaks the status quo, and Republicans tend to keep the status quo. Sure thats great sometimes, but right now thats deffently not a good thing.

Also, I'm not going to vote for a guy who thinks Spain is a Latin American country... WTF *Face Palm*

The UK.

[SpoonMan999]

Voting for change for the sake change is horrible. You should vote for the right change.

P.S.: We have a Democratic Congress who passed this bail out recently and has pushed us further into the dumps...why would we elect of the Democratic Senators responsible for our current situation?

[Nethran]

Hell, it was the republicans that put us in the dumps to begin with, so why should we vote for a republican senator, either? Hah.. Pickle.

[Obfuscate]

Hell, it was the republicans that put us in the dumps to begin with, so why should we vote for a republican senator, either? Hah.. Pickle.

*cough* Barney Frank (D) was the one who sat in front of a panel and said that both Fannie and Freddie were doing just fine and not taking unnecessary risk around 3-4 years ago. Now what was it that started this whole economic crisis?

[Nethran]

They needed help 4 years ago because the economy was beginning to get into trouble, so the blame can't lie with him.

[Obfuscate]

They needed help 4 years ago because the economy was beginning to get into trouble, so the blame can't lie with him.

I think you missed the part where I said Barney Frank plainly stated that Fannie and Freddie were do FINE 3-4 years ago, the audio is out on the net if you dig, and gave no indication they were in trouble, which they were since they were handing out loans like cookies at a blood drive. What I'm saying is that you can't blanket the blame on the Republicans. Fault lies on both sides and with consumers as well.

[Nethran]

Oh, I got what you said. I thought you were insinuating that the democrats shouldered a majority of the blame. I wholeheartedly agree that the responsibility for the state of the country lies with both parties.

[hellsing293]

The distribution of blame:

Republicans: Reagan economics and the belief that the economy can take care of itself has blown up in our faces.
Democrats: Pushing banks to make credit lending easier for lower-income families proved to be a BAD idea.
Consumers: Taking out a $300,000 mortgage with no money down and expecting to be able to pay for it.
Banks: Balloon mortgages vs. fixed mortgages screwing over consumers. Also stretched credit TOO far.
Events: Hurricane Katrina, The war in Iraq, 911, and increased tropical activity create more funding needs.
Ineffective President: Seriously, he's like a ghost in the white house. We need a strong leader in times like these (not taking political sides here)
Panicking investors: Don't pull out investments! You're ****ing things up even more right now.

Basically, the stars have been aligned for an economic difficulty. It's not so much one specific group as it is the combination of events.

[Aemaeth]

Hopefully soon england will get rid of it's useless prime minister also, that should help us at least.
I've not met one person who's had a good thing to say about Gordon brown.

[Nethran]

Bring back Blair! He has funny ears.

[SpoonMan999]

The distribution of blame:

Republicans: Reagan economics and the belief that the economy can take care of itself has blown up in our faces.
Democrats: Pushing banks to make credit lending easier for lower-income families proved to be a BAD idea.
Consumers: Taking out a $300,000 mortgage with no money down and expecting to be able to pay for it.
Banks: Balloon mortgages vs. fixed mortgages screwing over consumers. Also stretched credit TOO far.
Events: Hurricane Katrina, The war in Iraq, 911, and increased tropical activity create more funding needs.
Ineffective President: Seriously, he's like a ghost in the white house. We need a strong leader in times like these (not taking political sides here)
Panicking investors: Don't pull out investments! You're ****ing things up even more right now.

Basically, the stars have been aligned for an economic difficulty. It's not so much one specific group as it is the combination of events.

Reaganomics didn't blow up in our faces, Reaganomics works, Bush and Congress just ****ed it up and went crazy spending all sorts of money we didn't have. Apparently following Reagan's example is no longer a Republican belief and Conservatives have to consider themselves separate these days.

[[/sarcasm]]

*cough* Barney Frank (D) was the one who sat in front of a panel and said that both Fannie and Freddie were doing just fine and not taking unnecessary risk around 3-4 years ago. Now what was it that started this whole economic crisis?

Deregulation of markets certainly didn't help. Alan Greenspan himself went in front of Congress and said that his model of the economy was flawed and that rampant deregulation of markets was a bad idea.

Edit: By the way, saying that it's the democrat's fault because of the bailout is evading the fact that the bailout was needed to fix the problems that Conservative ideology got us into.

[SpoonMan999]

Deregulation of markets certainly didn't help. Alan Greenspan himself went in front of Congress and said that his model of the economy was flawed and that rampant deregulation of markets was a bad idea.

Edit: By the way, saying that it's the democrat's fault because of the bailout is evading the fact that the bailout was needed to fix the problems that Conservative ideology got us into.

Conservative ideology got us into? Let me give you a quick history lesson, shall I?

-Roosevelt pushed Fannie Mae through a Democratically controlled Congress.

-Freddie Mac was created by a Democratically controlled Congress in the 70's.

-In the late 70's the Community Reinvestment act was passed by Congress and signed into law by Jimmy Carter. What is this act? It encouraged banks and lenders to give home loans to people who would not normally qualify, and was backed by Freddie and Fannie.

-In the 90's President Clinton signed an executive order saying that lenders needed to give loans to people who would never qualify for a loan under any circumstances. Anyone not following this order would be denied Federal funds and access to Freddie and Fannie.

-In the late 90's Phil Gramm pushed through dregulation laws that would remove some Depression Era acts. This was a bad move and yes it was a Republican senator. Only two people in the Senate did not vote in favor of this act both of which were Republicans, one being John McCain. Biden blames the situation on Bush while Obama puts the blame on Gramm, though neglects to mention that his running mate voted for it and Clinton signed it into law.

-In 2003 Bush tried to reverse Clinton's executive order from the 90's in order to set things right again. The Democrats in Congress threatened to use a Fillibuster against the bill and stopped any attempts to reverse this decision (You need 60 votes in the Senate to stop a Fillibuster).

-In 2006, just two years ago, Alan Greenspan suggested that there be more oversight for Freddie and Fannie, exactly what Bush tried to do three years before. However, this responsibility falls on the Senate Comittee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs which Democrat Chriss Dodd is the chairman of. This of course upset Dodd considering he was number one on Fannie and Freddie's campagin contribution list (Obama being number two).

-Dodd said he'd support the bailout but wants more oversight...which he could have had but doesn't want to admit he wasn't doing his job.

-Every piece of legislation that Republicans have brought in to regulate the financial industry since 2000 has beaten back by Democrats in Congress.

And here's some stats for you... about 95% of Americans pay their mortgage on time. It's that 5% going into forclosure that is ****ing us and they are a direct result of the events I've described above.

You're entering this debate armed only with what you've heard on CNN, again I urge you to do some research. And if you've been surfing the web moveon.org is not a reliable source no matter how much you like what they're saying.

[hellsing293]

Well, at least we're not communists

[[/sarcasm]]

I get all my news from Colbert, Jon Stewart, and The Onion.

Get it right.